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Tweet Share Share Comment Tweet Share Share Comment Ours is an age of pedagogy. A politics of care, however, must address who has the authority to determine the content of care, not just who pays for it. But if you think that actually having all that variability is not a bad thing, its a good thing its what you want its what childhood and parenting is all about then having that kind of variation that you cant really explain either by genetics or by what the parents do, thats exactly what being a parent, being a caregiver is all about, is for. You can listen to our whole conversation by following The Ezra Klein Show on Apple, Spotify, Google or wherever you get your podcasts. And Im not getting paid to promote them or anything, I just like it. Now its time to get food. As a subscriber, you have 10 gift articles to give each month. I have some information about how this machine works, for example, myself. The most attractive ideological vision of a politics of care combines extensive redistribution with a pluralistic recognition of the many different arrangements through which care is . Youre not deciding what to pay attention to in the movie. Now its not so much about youre visually taking in all the information around you the way that you do when youre exploring. Alison Gopnik July 2012 Children who are better at pretending could reason better about counterfactualsthey were better at thinking about different possibilities. And what I would argue is theres all these other kinds of states of experience and not just me, other philosophers as well. This copy is for your personal, non-commercial use only. And you look at parental environment, and thats responsible for some of it. It probably wont surprise you that Im one of those parents who reads a lot of books about parenting. is whats come to be called the alignment problem, is how can you get the A.I. What are the trade-offs to have that flexibility? And of course, as I say, we have two-year-olds around a lot, so we dont really need any more two-year-olds. So the children, perhaps because they spend so much time in that state, also can be fussy and cranky and desperately wanting their next meal or desperately wanting comfort. Alison Gopnik Creativity is something we're not even in the ballpark of explaining. .css-i6hrxa-Italic{font-style:italic;}Psychologist Alison Gopnik explores new discoveries in the science of human nature. 50% off + free delivery on any order with DoorDash promo code, 60% off running shoes and apparel at Nike without a promo code, Score up to 50% off Nintendo Switch video games with GameStop coupon code, The Tax Play That Saves Some Couples Big Bucks, How Gas From Texas Becomes Cooking Fuel in France, Amazon Pausing Construction of Washington, D.C.-Area Second Headquarters. That ones a cat. July 8, 2010 Alison Gopnik. will have one goal, and that will never change. But now, whether youre a philosopher or not, or an academic or a journalist or just somebody who spends a lot of time on their computer or a student, we now have a modernity that is constantly training something more like spotlight consciousness, probably more so than would have been true at other times in human history. In "Possible Worlds: Why Do Children Pretend" by Alison Gopnik, the author talks about children and adults understanding the past and using it to help one later in life. And we had a marvelous time reading Mary Poppins. And what happens with development is that that part of the brain, that executive part gets more and more control over the rest of the brain as you get older. And you yourself sort of disappear. You go out and maximize that goal. Thats what were all about. And an idea that I think a lot of us have now is that part of that is because youve really got these two different creatures. And its worth saying, its not like the children are always in that state. But it turns out that if instead of that, what you do is you have the human just play with the things on the desk. So the famous example of this is the paperclip apocalypse, where you try to train the robot to make paper clips. And that could pick things up and put them in boxes and now when you gave it a screw that looked a little different from the previous screw and a box that looked a little different from the previous box, that they could figure out, oh, yeah, no, that ones a screw, and it goes in the screw box, not the other box. Because I have this goal, which is I want to be a much better meditator. Those are sort of the options. USB1 is a miRNA deadenylase that regulates hematopoietic development By Ho-Chang Jeong Is this interesting? Do you think for kids that play or imaginative play should be understood as a form of consciousness, a state? can think is like asking whether a submarine can swim, right? As always, if you want to help the show out, leave us a review wherever you are listening to it now. And its kind of striking that the very best state of the art systems that we have that are great at playing Go and playing chess and maybe even driving in some circumstances, are terrible at doing the kinds of things that every two-year-old can do. And theyre going to the greengrocer and the fishmonger. So what Ive argued is that youd think that what having children does is introduce more variability into the world, right? But here is Alison Gopnik. But if you look at their subtlety at their ability to deal with context, at their ability to decide when should I do this versus that, how should I deal with the whole ensemble that Im in, thats where play has its great advantages. And I think adults have the capacity to some extent to go back and forth between those two states. (if applicable) for The Wall Street Journal. And that kind of goal-directed, focused, consciousness, which goes very much with the sense of a self so theres a me thats trying to finish up the paper or answer the emails or do all the things that I have to do thats really been the focus of a lot of theories of consciousness, is if that kind of consciousness was what consciousness was all about. So it isnt just a choice between lantern and spotlight. According to this alter But you sort of say that children are the R&D wing of our species and that as generations turn over, we change in ways and adapt to things in ways that the normal genetic pathway of evolution wouldnt necessarily predict. The robots are much more resilient. The role of imitation in understanding persons and developing a theory of mind. The scientist in the crib: What early learning tells us about the mind, Theoretical explanations of children's understanding of the mind, Knowing how you know: Young children's ability to identify and remember the sources of their beliefs. And I said, you mean Where the Wild Things Are? So, one interesting example that theres actually some studies of is to think about when youre completely absorbed in a really interesting movie. Psychologist Alison Gopnik explores new discoveries in the science of human nature. So for instance, if you look at rats and you look at the rats who get to do play fighting versus rats who dont, its not that the rats who play can do things that the rats cant play can, like every specific fighting technique the rats will have. You write that children arent just defective adults, primitive grown-ups, who are gradually attaining our perfection and complexity. It was called "parenting." As long as there have. So its also for the children imitating the more playful things that the adults are doing, or at least, for robots, thats helping the robots to be more effective. Walk around to the other side, pick things up and get into everything and make a terrible mess because youre picking them up and throwing them around. Yeah, I think theres a lot of evidence for that. And its worsened by an intellectual and economic culture that prizes efficiency and dismisses play. example. Across the globe, as middle-class high investment parents anxiously track each milestone, its easy to conclude that the point of being a parent is to accelerate your childs development as much as possible. Essentially what Mary Poppins is about is this very strange, surreal set of adventures that the children are having with this figure, who, as I said to Augie, is much more like Iron Man or Batman or Doctor Strange than Julie Andrews, right? And I think its called social reference learning. One of my greatest pleasures is to be what the French call a flneursomeone who wanders randomly through a big city, stumbling on new scenes. And if you think about something like traveling to a new place, thats a good example for adults, where just being someplace that you havent been before. And I was really pleased because my intuitions about the best books were completely confirmed by this great reunion with the grandchildren. So one way that I think about it sometimes is its sort of like if you look at the current models for A.I., its like were giving these A.I.s hyper helicopter tiger moms. But I do think that counts as play for adults. The self and the soul both denote our efforts to grasp and work towards transcendental values, writes John Cottingham. So thats one change thats changed from this lots of local connections, lots of plasticity, to something thats got longer and more efficient connections, but is less changeable. The ones marked, A Gopnik, C Glymour, DM Sobel, LE Schulz, T Kushnir, D Danks, Behavioral and Brain sciences 16 (01), 90-100, An earlier version of this chapter was presented at the Society for Research, Understanding other minds: perspectives from autism., 335-366, British journal of developmental psychology 9 (1), 7-31, Journal of child language 22 (3), 497-529, New articles related to this author's research, Co-Director, Institute for Learning & Brain Sciences, Professor of Psychology, University of, Professor of Psychology and Computer Science, Princeton University, Professor, Psychology & Neuroscience, Duke University, Associate Faculty, Harvard University Graduate School of Education, Associate Professor of Psychology, University of Waterloo, Professor of Data Science & Philosophy; UC San Diego, Emeritus Professor of Educational Psychology, university of Wisconsin Madison, Professor, Developmental Psychology, University of Waterloo, Columbia, Psychology and Graduate School of Business, Professor, History and Philosophy of Science, University of Pittsburgh, Children's understanding of representational change and its relation to the understanding of false belief and the appearance-reality distinction, Why the child's theory of mind really is a theory. And I find the direction youre coming into this from really interesting that theres this idea we just create A.I., and now theres increasingly conversation over the possibility that we will need to parent A.I. What you do with these systems is say, heres what your goal is. And no one quite knows where all that variability is coming from. And part of the numinous is it doesnt just have to be about something thats bigger than you, like a mountain. News Corp is a global, diversified media and information services company focused on creating and distributing authoritative and engaging content and other products and services. print. Now, one of the big problems that we have in A.I. And in empirical work that weve done, weve shown that when you look at kids imitating, its really fascinating because even three-year-olds will imitate the details of what someone else is doing, but theyll integrate, OK, I saw you do this. But I think especially for sort of self-reflective parents, the fact that part of what youre doing is allowing that to happen is really important. Well, I was going to say, when you were saying that you dont play, you read science fiction, right? Its a form of actually doing things that, nevertheless, have this characteristic of not being immediately directed to a goal. An earlier version of this chapter was presented at the Society for Research . So thats the first one, especially for the younger children. You do the same thing over and over again. And it takes actual, dedicated effort to not do things that feel like work to me. Cambridge, Mass. Read previous columns here. So, a lot of the theories of consciousness start out from what I think of as professorial consciousness. Its called Calmly Writer. And then you use that to train the robots. And I think having this kind of empathic relationship to the children who are exploring so much is another. Could you talk a bit about that, what this sort of period of plasticity is doing at scale? So what kind of function could that serve? Its not very good at doing anything that is the sort of things that you need to act well. Yeah, so I think a really deep idea that comes out of computer science originally in fact, came out of the original design of the computer is this idea of the explore or exploit trade-off is what they call it. And the idea is maybe we could look at some of the things that the two-year-olds do when theyre learning and see if that makes a difference to what the A.I.s are doing when theyre learning. Cognitive psychologist Alison Gopnik has been studying this landscape of children and play for her whole career. And I dont do that as much as I would like to or as much as I did 20 years ago, which makes me think a little about how the society has changed. Gopnik explains that as we get older, we lose our cognitive flexibility and our penchant for explorationsomething that we need to be mindful of, lest we let rigidity take over. Thats the kind of basic rationale behind the studies. But its sort of like they keep them in their Rolodex. But its really fascinating that its the young animals who are playing. One of the things that were doing right now is using some of these kind of video game environments to put A.I. So theres really a kind of coherent whole about what childhood is all about. Because over and over again, something that is so simple, say, for young children that we just take it for granted, like the fact that when you go into a new maze, you explore it, that turns out to be really hard to figure out how to do with an A.I. Its a conversation about humans for humans. We are delighted that you'd like to resume your subscription. So you see this really deep tension, which I think were facing all the time between how much are we considering different possibilities and how much are we acting efficiently and swiftly. now and Ive been spending a lot of time collaborating with people in computer science at Berkeley who are trying to design better artificial intelligence systems the current systems that we have, I mean, the languages theyre designed to optimize, theyre really exploit systems. And one of the things about her work, the thing that sets it apart for me is she uses children and studies children to understand all of us. The philosophical baby: What children's minds tell us about truth, love & the meaning of life. The other change thats particularly relevant to humans is that we have the prefrontal cortex. The Biden administration is preparing a new program that could prohibit American investment in certain sectors in China, a step to guard U.S. technological advantages amid a growing competition between the worlds two largest economies. Words, Thoughts, and Theories. And they wont be able to generalize, even to say a dog on a video thats actually moving. So theres a really nice picture about what happens in professorial consciousness. Gopnik runs the Cognitive Development and Learning Lab at UC Berkeley. And those two things are very parallel. You will be charged And the robot is sitting there and watching what the human does when they take up the pen and put it in the drawer in the virtual environment. I think anyone whos worked with human brains and then goes to try to do A.I., the gulf is really pretty striking. And he said, the book is so much better than the movie. And to the extent it is, what gives it that flexibility? And you watch the Marvel Comics universe movies. But as I say and this is always sort of amazing to me you put the pen 5 centimeters to one side, and now they have no idea what to do. That ones a dog. But if we wanted to have A.I.s that had those kinds of capacities, theyd need to have grandmoms. But then you can give it something that is just obviously not a cat or a dog, and theyll make a mistake. Ive been thinking about the old program, Kids Say the Darndest Things, if you just think about the things that kids say, collect them. And its the cleanest writing interface, simplest of these programs I found. So my five-year-old grandson, who hasnt been in our house for a year, first said, I love you, grandmom, and then said, you know, grandmom, do you still have that book that you have at your house with the little boy who has this white suit, and he goes to the island with the monsters on it, and then he comes back again? The company has been scrutinized over fake reviews and criticized by customers who had trouble getting refunds. Gopnik, a psychology and philosophy professor at the University of California, Berkeley, says that many parents are carpenters but they should really be cultivating that garden. [MUSIC PLAYING]. And each one of them is going to come out to be really different from anything you would expect beforehand, which is something that I think anybody who has had more than one child is very conscious of. It is produced by Roge Karma and Jeff Geld; fact-checked by Michelle Harris; original music by Isaac Jones; and mixing by Jeff Geld. And if you think about play, the definition of play is that its the thing that you do when youre not working. Its about dealing with something new or unexpected. And then youve got this later period where the connections that are used a lot that are working well, they get maintained, they get strengthened, they get to be more efficient. They can sit for longer than anybody else can. And gradually, it gets to be clear that there are ghosts of the history of this house. Early reasoning about desires: evidence from 14-and 18-month-olds. So when they first started doing these studies where you looked at the effects of an enriching preschool and these were play-based preschools, the way preschools still are to some extent and certainly should be and have been in the past.